Curse

Aldric · Oct 30, 2010, 06:02 PM // 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fay Vert

MM + PI + Big Boss AOE = Instant Dead Big Boss

This, for any other Daze needs technobabble or a mes hench/hero is better than a dedicated BHA ranger

Xiaquin · Oct 30, 2010, 10:43 PM // 22:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldric

This, for any other Daze needs technobabble or a mes hench/hero is better than a dedicated BHA ranger

Assuming A) the minions provide an opportunity and B) the party has Technobabble or a mesmer. But a henchman? I'd take humans every time, at least they won't stand in AoE. Also, with a ranger, don't monsters treat them as a lower priority, given they have higher base armor?

Also, I'm not sure why BHA is considered a single-purpose build. It's a Marksmanship elite, one could still do decent damage and even Splinter Weapon if Barrage is so terribly missed.

I'm not saying it's an all-purpose elite to bring, but I'm a little surprised at the snubbing. There are nearly 30 non-Beast Mastery ranger elites, and I would put BHA in the top 5-6 that are actually useful in PvE.

Mashiyu · Oct 30, 2010, 11:11 PM // 23:11

BHA is good for long boss battles against bossed which are not resistant/immune against conditions/interupting. Yes it's a niche skill, but at least has some use (isn't a bash-second-wind-thread active atm?)

For mass rupt on a ranger, I'd try Technobrabble+Barrage (never tried it, it just came to mind)

Aldric · Oct 31, 2010, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

Assuming A) the minions provide an opportunity and B) the party has Technobabble or a mesmer. But a henchman? I'd take humans every time, at least they won't stand in AoE. Also, with a ranger, don't monsters treat them as a lower priority, given they have higher base armor?

a) minions+party +aoe boss + PI from what ive seen virtually always results in near death. The boss will hit enough members to make it worthwhile
b) well thats the point. Filling that last party slot with either a mes hero or someone with technobabble > BHA ranger

I agree with henchman point, shouldnt have been in my post since its not really targetable on the boss needing shutdown.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

Also, I'm not sure why BHA is considered a single-purpose build. It's a Marksmanship elite, one could still do decent damage and even Splinter Weapon if Barrage is so terribly missed.

You could have a BHA bar which does some damage but it won't be particularly good in comparison to most other builds you can run

Not sure what you mean about barrage, it isnt a build ive run very often, other than WiK, in the last couple of years.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

I'm not saying it's an all-purpose elite to bring, but I'm a little surprised at the snubbing. There are nearly 30 non-Beast Mastery ranger elites, and I would put BHA in the top 5-6 that are actually useful in PvE.

After 3-4 rangers elites I would be onto secondary ones instead. BHA is only usefull in the odd place and other than that your aswell taking a build which kills quicker and makes you more useful to a party.

I did run BHA quite alot when doing all my vanq'ing but then realised i wasnt particularly contributing much to the group so i switched to a damage build and it made a huge difference.

If i really had to have daze and couldnt run techno or have a mesmer I would probably still not take BHA. Having a play around with builds I think I could use Stunning Strike much more frequently than i could BHA, only downside with that would be the 5 secs at the start of a fight it would be uncharged.

Xiaquin · Oct 31, 2010, 01:44 AM // 01:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldric

a) minions+party +aoe boss + PI..
b)...Filling that last party slot with either a mes hero or someone with technobabble > BHA ranger
You could have a BHA bar which does some damage but it won't be particularly good in comparison to most other builds you can run

I just meant we are assuming best-case scenario that these elements exist in a party and are worth their weight. In theory, yes, almost anything can become replaceable, but if we are going to have that discussion, technically no party needs a ranger at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldric

Not sure what you mean about barrage, it isnt a build ive run very often, other than WiK, in the last couple of years.

I feel it's overrated; the general consensus seems to be that it's a ranger's one trick. I rarely run it, myself.

Sometimes I bring BHA, I really wasn't trying to make it out to be a support staple, but, it's far from how bad it's being portrayed as, I don't want others reading to think it sucks. That's how you end up with players who, when you ask them for other builds, they have nothing.

Just so I'm not way off-topic, yes I believe BHA can be viable for a caster-hate build. I just wouldn't rely on it alone.

Meridon · Oct 31, 2010, 04:57 PM // 16:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

Pets are painfully slow, maybe slower than BHA. BM+Ymlad avoids slotting an elite, but has a higher energy cost and longer recharge time as well, to go along with pet woes. To make up for this you could bring in Call of Haste, but now we're up to half your build, including Comfort Animal. Also, consider that pets will die, especially in HM, so there is some risk.

Don't underestimate a pet. Scavenger Strike is the best way for a ranger to directly manage his energy through energy gain, especially if you run it next to 13 Expertise. If running a daze build, a pet synergizes with it completely. Pets who die don't recieve DP anyway, and your backline will heal it just as well.

At 10+1 Beast mastery, I think it's a great deal, you get an extra frontliner, who manages your energy, helps you interrupt with daze, can possibly inflict daze itself, and deals damage. And my pet is cute <3

I did Ooze pit yesterday on Hard Mode, and the YMlaD+BM helped shutting down the final Ele boss completely. That's without even dedicating my bar to it, cause I always bring a pet

Lourens · Oct 31, 2010, 04:57 PM // 16:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meridon

Don't underestimate a pet. Scavenger Strike is the best way for a ranger to directly manage his energy. If running a daze build, a pet synergizes with it completely. Pets who die don't recieve DP anyway, and your backline will heal it just as well.

At 10+1 Beast mastery, I think it's a great deal, you get an extra frontliner, who manages your energy, helps you interrupt with daze, can possibly inflict daze itself, and deals damage. And my pet is cute <3

I did Ooze pit yesterday on Hard Mode, and the YMlaD+BM helped shutting down the final Ele boss completely. That's without even dedicating my bar to it, cause I always bring a pet

Marksman Wager works to

Meridon · Oct 31, 2010, 05:01 PM // 17:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lourens

Marksman Wager works to

That's again an Elite slot you're wasting.

Xiaquin · Oct 31, 2010, 09:02 PM // 21:02

@Meridon I don't underestimate pets, but that's far off topic. In short, pets take their sweet time getting anything done.

I support full pet builds, but on a whim, I'm grabbing BHA and invoking other utilities (Technobabble, Ymlad, interrupts, etc.) or damage. Two different schools of thought, I suppose.

gw_poster · Nov 09, 2010, 11:37 PM // 23:37

I used BHA throughout my GWAMM-grinding and h/h'ed everywhere using plain vanilla sabway and always a mes and ele hench, along with random other two henchies. I always played pve with cupcakes, eggs, gr/bl/r candy, candy corn, apples, etc. for the added efficiency (and +1s). I never thought I was doing "massive" damage, but I know that BHA came in very handy when confronting monk bosses and multi-healer groups. My build was pretty much this (max eotn ranks):

[pain inverter][ebon vanguard assassin support][lightning reflexes][broad head arrow][savage shot][distracting shot][finish him!][flesh of my flesh] (or needling shot)

Arutima · Nov 10, 2010, 04:05 PM // 16:05

the only places i use Bha is in misisons and dungeons , like against duncan the black

the other times, i use either prepared shot (to spam maxed lvl pve skills) or burning arrow.

Balky · Nov 16, 2010, 07:45 PM // 19:45

How about a big spike build with disrupting accuracy and....................concussion shot :P

Rites · Dec 20, 2010, 05:19 AM // 05:19

i guess i don't mind the broadhepidemic much, but thats also probably because i try to stay away from the PvE only skills. specially the asuran ones, they seem so...... unbalanced.

But yes, a pet that can take care of the condition throwing AND helps manage your energy is my way of playing

Amy Awien · Dec 20, 2010, 08:53 AM // 08:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balky

How about a big spike build with disrupting accuracy and....................concussion shot :P

You wouldn't want the critical to take away the interrupt and the daze from concussion. Beside, Disrupting Accuracy is mostly of use only for A/R, a primary ranger is better of with choking gas.

Balky · Dec 20, 2010, 09:20 AM // 09:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

You wouldn't want the critical to take away the interrupt and the daze from concussion. Beside, Disrupting Accuracy is mostly of use only for A/R, a primary ranger is better of with choking gas.

Completely and utterly disagree with that comment about disrupting accuracy

Pure Ranger build i`ve used in JQ with a great deal of success, Caps, Kills Jugs, and trust me, you interrupt casters constantly.

Poison Tip Sig, Disrupting Accuracy, Burning Arrow, Hunters Shot, Savage, Needling, Throw dirt, Troll Unguent

Marks 12+3+1
Expertise 12+2
Wild 3

Customised 20/20 Hornbow with Marks Wrap and Strength and Honour Inscrip

For PVE i just drop needling, throw dirt and troll ung and add asuran scan, ymlad and assassin support , works a treat, works damn well in norn fighting tournament too

Cuilan · Dec 20, 2010, 07:33 PM // 19:33

A slow hornbow with a skill that needs critical hits with single target poison on a ranger doesn't sound so hot. All your impactful skills are the three PvE skills that don't have any unique synergy with the build.

Balky · Dec 20, 2010, 09:42 PM // 21:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

A slow hornbow with a skill that needs critical hits with single target poison on a ranger doesn't sound so hot. All your impactful skills are the three PvE skills that don't have any unique synergy with the build.

16 marks spiking to 17, 10% armour pen spiking to 30, asuran scan, trust me i get more than enough crits

Amy Awien · Dec 20, 2010, 10:08 PM // 22:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balky

Completely and utterly disagree with that comment about disrupting accuracy

You have a 1 in 5 chance to crit, less in hard mode and you'll interrupt something useful only when your target happens to be using a skill.

It's a wasted slot for anything but primary assassins.

Quote:

... Hornbow ...

Lowest refire rate bow there is with almost the slowest arrow speed and a range that is not quite sufficient for capping in JQ. Whatever succes you believe to have, you'd have more with another bow and preparation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balky

... trust me i get more than enough crits

Well, the 23% chance to score a crit that might interrupt something if the target happens to be casting certainly wouldn't be enough for me.

RedDog91 · Dec 20, 2010, 10:56 PM // 22:56

To be honest, in PvE you don't really need a caster-hate build. Your team will be killings way too fast for it to really matter.

The only time it may be reasonable to use caster-hate in pve is when you are planning on facing a relatively difficult casting boss. Otherwise, best just to go for as much damage and survivability as possible.

Xiaquin · Dec 20, 2010, 11:06 PM // 23:06

I would only take DA if I wasn't concerned about efficiency, and more or less just throwing it in for laughs on a quick run somewhere. If I bring an interrupt in PvE it's to specifically shut something down, I can't rely on random chance. Sins will reap the benefit, like they do too often in this game.